(Nav not a shot at your recent rules)

Curious! The gold standard for a long time was that mafia/cult/whatever’s wincon was to reach half the total players, you hit 50% and it’s over

I’ve noticed here and there some people running it as over 50%. Or half+1 or whatever you wanna call it

Just wondering which people prefer and if there are good arguments for or against either. I actually think we might’ve made this same thread a couple years ago but good to revisit

The ooooold wincon used to be something like, “you win when you make up half the players and nothing prevents you from something something something”.

Which is a bit weird, because I THINK that used to mean like, if mafia had half but there was an SK left alive who could kill one of them, or a roleblocker who could stop their kill, that final night kill to seal it wasn’t so inevitable anymore. I think we did away with that pretty quickly though? Especially as we introduced more roles and things became less standard each game, from then on it turned into hitting 50% immediately seals it and ends it, it was just cleaner

im317 @ 23/10/2023 15:50

im not sure it should be a %. just make it when there win is inevitable even if everyone else does everything perfectly. what if mafia has half going into the night but town has a re-director the mafia cant counter? should mafia win just because they have half or should they have to outguess the re-director in either who does the killing or who they are going to kill. really the 50% is for the base mafia plus town with few if any power roles. i would rather play it out then end it early at 50% and find out there was a way for someone else to win

Yeah it’s a bit tricky. A little cat and mouse guessing game between mafia and remaining town does sound fun, but I also think if that were to happen every game with an outed mafia team then it would grow old kinda fast. Sometimes I really hate when it gets to the point of a game continuing with an outed team who just has to go through the motions, and at the same time I would hate to be a townie in the minority with a hidden team still playing along and playing with their food, that’s really never fun. If either of those happened every game instead of a mercy ending then it would get stale I think

It would also take away from the impact of a game very suddenly being over at 50% and town realizing who scum was with the reveal, which can be kinda fun. If that makes sense

I definitely think “Nothing Prevents It” clause is a lot harder these days than it was when we started. I would hate to see a host end a game early without realizing that xyz could’ve still done something. Feels unlikely but I dunno, depends on how whacky roles are in any given game I guess

Could also see inactives being an issue and causing people to call foul on hosts, like if a scum member is entirely inactive and their inactivity would technically prevent an inevitable lynch. Gets a little grey, I would definitely only consider roles when it comes to Nothing Prevents It and not activity

I would bet a good amount of our mafia victories could have continued playing out and prevented the mafia from actually winning even after they reached majority. At the very least some more mafia members would’ve been killed along the way

What would you all do if it was like the following:

4 mafia
5 town, a townie gets lynched, game would usually be over but we’re doing the kill the threats rule etc
1 townie is a roleblocker and one is a redirector
Mafia kills another townie, so it’s 4 mafia and 3 townies, two are RBer and redirector

At that point it’s a playing with your food scenario a bit. Let’s say the RBer blocks a kill the next night and excitedly is like guess what everyone, I blocked xyz and there was no kill so they’re mafia. And they think they’re the man and everyone is like yay good job, and then scum dumps 4 votes on the roleblocker throughout the day instead of the person they blocked. Fun? Annoying? Cruel? I dunno! Are these scenarios too unlikely for this to even matter?

Boc @ 23/10/2023 16:26

Curtis @ 23/10/2023 15:18 I would bet a good amount of our mafia victories could have continued playing out and prevented the mafia from actually winning even after they reached majority. At the very least some more mafia members would’ve been killed along the way I can assure you that was NOT the case in the last game I hosted!

Strike it from the record!

Grumpy Ass Old Woman @ 23/10/2023 17:24

It's always been 51%

No it hasn’t lol

Spin @ 23/10/2023 19:57

If it's 4v4 (or whatever number you want to use) going into a day phase, I always play it out, because you never know when one of the mafia will go AWOL and not be around to vote. I'm not going to reward a group/player for inactivity, ever.

Idk, I’d hardly call that rewarding a group for inactivity. Sounds more like punishing a group for one player’s potential inactivity tbh

“If there are as many mafiosi as innocents in the day-phase then a mafia victory is declared immediately, under the original Mafia rules.”

The ‘by the book’ rules

I like the rule of thumb that the game ends if a day phase starts with 50%, that makes sense to me. If a night starts at 50% then maybe the town still has that final night to do something about it. If they fail to, and if the day starts at 50/50, then it ends

im317 @ 26/10/2023 13:13

wasn't og mafia just 1 cop and the rest vanilla?

Def, but that rule still makes sense to me, kinda feels like the best of both worlds? Game doesn’t end if a day ends at 50%, but if a new day STARTS at 50% then sorry town, game over

Again I’m not tryna have us all agree on one ruling, every game will be different, just curious what people prefer and why

Spin @ 26/10/2023 14:28

Curtis @ 26/10/2023 12:21 im317 @ 26/10/2023 13:13 wasn't og mafia just 1 cop and the rest vanilla? Def, but that rule still makes sense to me, kinda feels like the best of both worlds? Game doesn’t end if a day ends at 50%, but if a new day STARTS at 50% then sorry town, game over Wouldn’t a 50/50 game to start a day almost always end the day 50/50 and tied? If so, and you’d play out the night in that case, why not play out the day?

It’s just…boring? And like I said earlier, it just becomes taunty and feels bad for the four townies who either know they already lost or have no idea it’s already game over