Haha yeah he does but I'd like to see it for more than just a four game span before I'm a firm believer!

19 TDs 0 INT's not enough for you?

and yeah, Payton will probably win MVP, but still... look at who he's throwing to. Demariyus, Welker, Decker, Julius Thomas.

Yes he's an incredible QB, but you give those receivers (at this point in their careers) to any legit QB and they will do wonders. The Seahawks would have been even more deadlier if they had those types of receivers. As much as Payton deserves it, people are going to ignore the wealth of receivers he has and just give it to him based on his name and age. IDK, I feel like Wilson got overlooked for ROY last year due to the seasons Luck/Griffin had, and he will this year too.

One INT got called back last game against the Cardinals when the flag really didn't affect the play at all and two different INTs were dropped in the Green Bay game. He hasn't played a single good pass defense in any of his starts and a lot of the teams he has played are awful lol.

I'm not saying he isn't good at all, but I'm not fully convinced he is a Pro Bowl type QB just yet.

Plus, I was at the game against the Cowboys where he literally looked like one of the worst QBs I have ever seen haha

Fair enough, haha. I hate him because the week my opponent had Payton on bye, he picked up Foles and he threw 7 TD's.... I lost by .24 points in my money league.

#BringBackVick

If the Panthers beat the Saints in New Orleans, do you guys think they are a serious contender?

I feel like everybody is still down/sleeping on them when they've beat quality opponents, and barely lost to the Seahawks week 1 (granted two of their losses were duds - Bills and Cards)

Panthers are legit IMO. Their defense is for real and Cam is playing by far the best of his career. I think them beating the Saints would get them the respect they deserve, but I honestly think they are legit

Panthers/Seahawks NFC championship... oh man.

Seahawks would probably win out since it'd be in Seattle but I think it'd be an exciting game. Wilson will probably outwork the Panthers D down the field with his passes, and if Newton is on target with his deep passes, I think he can get some in over the Legion of Boom too (they struggle with small, quick guys and deep balls - T.Y Hilton went off on them, Seahawks are built to cover guys like Dez and Calvin)

I'd LIKE the Panthers to be legit because I really like Cam (which is weird because I hated him when he was at Auburn) but I'm still not completely sold for some reason. If they beat the Saints in the Superdome they definitely are for real though

Vic @ 5/12/2013 22:47

Yeah, I mean, a lot of things get taken into consideration when deciding who gets MVP. The whole point of the award is who is the most valuable to their team and honestly, it has to be Peyton because the Seahawks would still be a playoff team with their defense and run game being so successful. I do love Wilson though and fully expect at least one MVP award for him during the course of his career. I wish the Eagles took him...

Most valuable to a team? Tom Brady.
With the lack of talent around him, the Patriots wouldn't have more than 3 wins. With all the talent around Manning, the Broncos wouldn't win the AFC West, but they'd be in Wild card contention. I'm not saying Manning isn't crazy good this year, but without Manning the Broncos would be in a better place than the Patriots without Brady.

Johnny @ 6/12/2013 11:56

Vic @ 5/12/2013 22:47 Yeah, I mean, a lot of things get taken into consideration when deciding who gets MVP. The whole point of the award is who is the most valuable to their team and honestly, it has to be Peyton because the Seahawks would still be a playoff team with their defense and run game being so successful. I do love Wilson though and fully expect at least one MVP award for him during the course of his career. I wish the Eagles took him... Most valuable to a team? Tom Brady. With the lack of talent around him, the Patriots wouldn't have more than 3 wins. With all the talent around Manning, the Broncos wouldn't win the AFC West, but they'd be in Wild card contention. I'm not saying Manning isn't crazy good this year, but without Manning the Broncos would be in a better place than the Patriots without Brady.

Brady was awful in the beginning of the season though. They were winning games because of their defense, which is a lot better than the Broncos' defense in my opinion.

Yeah... you could make that argument if he was tearing it up early in the year, but he only has gotten back to form with Gronk/Amendola (and now Vereen) all healthy. And that offense with those guys back still has a lot more talent than a lot of other teams

And anyway if you're going with the "this team would suck without them" argument, I think Rodgers is the clear winner (: Packers were contenders with him, and without him they haven't won a game and look like one of the worst teams in the league

^Man has a point. Packers are a perfect example - without Rodgers they are HORRIBLE. With him they are a threat to beat any team. Patriots won early in the season when Brady blew chunks. Bronco's would win games based on their receivers alone, even without Manning.

Obviously Rodgers won't win it because of the games he's missed - maybe they should rename the award, haha.

Oh. Bye, Kubiak! That was fast (:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10089214/gary-kubiak-coach-houston-texans-fired