CAMERAS EVERYWHERE

I’ve seen Disclosure! Demi lied about getting rape!

This thread is a win for me, Kevin Spacey and Igor ruin their reputation in it

Igor has a reputation?

Whilst I agree Igor was acting like a dick earlier (sorry bud), nothing he has said even slightly suggests that he is sexist and I find the accusation ridiculous. That accusation really holds no weight anymore given how wantonly it is thrown around.

I actually agree with a lot of what Igor has said over the past few pages. Guess I must be sexist too!

I am also concerned about the danger of false accusations. However, just because I am concerned about false accusations, doesn't mean I can't be supportive towards potential victims and want to see justice served.

I don't think anybody here disagrees that this abuse happens, nor that rich, powerful people have a tendency to get away with it (What crime do you not have a better chance of getting away with if you have money and influence?).

But personally I'm a little disturbed that some people appear to be fine with doing away with the presumption of innocence, as if it's just another obstacle the powerful use to obstruct justice, and not a basic legal right that protects us all.

I appreciate sexual abuse isn't an easy crime to prove, and there are a whole variety of reasons people don't come forward. But what are we supposed to do if not operate under the presumption of innocence toward the accused? Are we supposed to listen and believe instead?

I'm sure most of you would at least accept the possibility that some accusers will lie. Which leads me to ask; do you think it is an acceptable trade off that some people could have their lives ruined by false accusations if some genuine offenders are brought to justice?

There is something oddly appropriate happening in the UK right now which perfectly illustrates how ridiculous these things can become when presumption of innocence is sidestepped and given over to mob rule.

Tonight, the Defense Secretary resigned amid allegations that he placed a hand on a female journalists knee, 15 years ago. And the Deputy PM stands accused of the same thing, on top of sending a lurid text message (Oh the horror!). The latter accusation came from someone using the #MeToo hashtag.

It is true that to the rich and powerful, the law doesn't always apply, and I don't doubt that a lot of people are getting away with some heinous shit. But does that mean we should resort to what is essentially mob justice and trial by media?

meh

One more thing: I find the statement 'teach men not to rape' as pointless as 'teach men not to kill' Men know rape is wrong.

K bye

Yes, we are supposed to listen and be supportive if you have reason to believe them. I think for most people the burden of proof is less than the burden of proof for the police. If someone tells me they were assaulted I am inclined to believe them.

Wikey @ 1/11/2017 15:56

Whilst I agree Igor was acting like a dick earlier (sorry bud), nothing he has said even slightly suggests that he is sexist and I find the accusation ridiculous. That accusation really holds no weight anymore given how wantonly it is thrown around.

agreed. that's for judges and juries to decide. innocent until proven guilty.

Brett Ratner's turn to absolutely no one's surprise

http://www.latimes.com/business/hollywood/la-fi-ct-brett-ratner-allegations-20171101-htmlstory.html

The only way to reduce the incidents is through cultural change. If pretty much the only way these people get punished is if they get super flagrant, then unless we have a major culture shift, *nothing* will happen except for when an extreme case comes along. Then you have a quick overreaction, then back to status quo.

And you know what- if the defense Secretary wouldn't have done it to a male journalist, he shouldn't have done it to a female journalist. It's like the old Pulp Fiction line: "You ever given a foot massage to a man?"

how is this thread 12 pages long and WHY

I wonder what Concerned Mother thinks about all this

Boc @ 1/11/2017 16:24

I wonder what Concerned Mother thinks about all this

She's concerned.

Wikey

There is something oddly appropriate happening in the UK right now which perfectly illustrates how ridiculous these things can become when presumption of innocence is sidestepped and given over to mob rule. Tonight, the Defense Secretary resigned amid allegations that he placed a hand on a female journalists knee, 15 years ago. And the Deputy PM stands accused of the same thing, on top of sending a lurid text message (Oh the horror!). The latter accusation came from someone using the #MeToo hashtag.

It's happening everywhere, you know. It's the unraveling lol.

Every week there are new people in powerful positions who are being outed for these kinds of things, or things significantly worse. It's usually old stuff, see it as a stand against the "patriarchy", for a lack of a better word.

Wikey

I'm sure most of you would at least accept the possibility that some accusers will lie. Which leads me to ask; do you think it is an acceptable trade off that some people could have their lives ruined by false accusations if some genuine offenders are brought to justice?

In short, no. I don't want to get falsely accused of rape. Make it easier for women to report rape to the authorities, but don't throw innocement men into the same basket as the guilty pls.

As far as the teach men not to rape argument goes, I think it's ineffective. I mean, you could teach sexual morality from an early age and replace a bunch of parents I suppose, then the problem will be solved in a few generations when we're all dead. People that already rape or sexually offend others are probably not gonna listen to those kinds of opinions anyway.

Surprised no one brought up the issue of rape in the military yet...

Lets talk about rape in the military people